Discussions: Classic Cars: So Seinfeld says" fix it again Tony!" Classic Motorsports Magazine

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So Seinfeld says" fix it again Tony!"

April 3, 2008 10:39 p.m. jm1na

http://www.cbc.ca/world/story/2008/04/03/seinfeld-crash.html?ref=rss

So a BTM is a dino coupe. Gotta love those Italian made brakes... yuk yuk!
April 4, 2008 5:47 a.m. Dwight Varnes

First, you're wrong. It was not a Dino Coupe, it was a 500.

Second, as a person who has owned over 20 Fiats, you're not very funny. At least our cars survived beyond 1980.
April 4, 2008 8:22 a.m. Brett Melancon

And I guess that British brakes are better? When did you guys finally figure out that discs are better? I guess that if you are using a tractor engine, you don't really need good brakes.
April 4, 2008 8:50 a.m. Tim Baxter Online Editor

Wrong and wrong.

MG survived well past 1980, but not in the American market.In fact, MG and Fiat both gave up on America at about the same time. Doesn't mean they didn't survive (although MG's future is cloudy right now).

And the Brits were pretty much the first to figure out discs are better. Jag, Triumph, MG and Austin-Healey all had them standard in the mid-50s. I believe Fiat didn't get them until 1960.

All of which is wholly irrelevant. Seinfeld's Fiat is more than 40 years old. Any car that old needs the brakes inspected closely and repaired as needed, no matter how good they were when they were new, or whether it was made in Italy, England, or Uranus.
April 4, 2008 9:25 a.m. racerdave600

In all my Italian cars, I never, ever had a brake failure. Typically, they are VERY good. Part of the problem these days, and this applies to all countries of origin, is the quality of replacement parts. There is some real garbage out there roaming around, so it could have been a failure of say a replacement master cylinder that did not meet factory specs. You never know. 500's did have very small drum brakes, but then again, it had like 16hp in stock trim.

I love British cars too, but I had two total brake failures on my TR4, plus a frame rail break, something you never see on a Fiat unless its from the rust belt. Fiats really get a bum rap, mostly from people that have never owned one, or bought an already bodged one.
April 4, 2008 9:29 a.m. Brett Melancon

I agree with the inspection of old cars, regardless. I simple tire of hearing the Fix it again jokes. It simply is not true. Don't you guys tire of hearing the prince of darkness crap. Of course, there may be more truth to that part. Just kidding!

For the record, I love British stuff but I love Italian stuff more. I had an Austin Healey years ago and loved it. Of course, the brakes and engine were not near as entertaining as their Italian cousins.
April 4, 2008 9:35 a.m. Tim Baxter Online Editor

Fiats really get a bum rap, mostly from people that have never owned one, or bought an already bodged one.

So does the British stuff. Too many people seem to think if it's not done the Chevy or Ford way (or nowadays, the Honda way) then it's crap, so you get a lot of bad jokes, and a lot of half-witted "improvements". My MGs were among the most reliable cars I've ever owned. Certainly moreso than my '99 Subaru.
April 4, 2008 10:01 a.m. Apis Mellifera

I never knew the Fiat crowd was such a sensitive lot.

The first thing that comes to my mind when someone is critical of OLD cars is, "Wow, this person has no idea how to maintain, let alone understand, the simplest of mechanical concepts."

In my experience with British cars, most failures are the result of neglect and/or shortcut repairs...and that's no fault of the car nor the Englishman that designed it. I bought a Midget once that had an honest to goodness wall light switch bodged into the wiring. Who deserves the bad rep for that one? Lucas? I knew a Fiat owner once that replaced just the inner part of a wheel bearing because he was too cheap to buy all the needed parts.

The newest of the cars we have in the US are nearing 30 years old and most were owned at some point by a complete idiot.

I will say, however, that there is one valid criticism relating to the Brits; no provision for weatherproofing on the wiring loom was a real design misfire (or in some cases a source of fire, as it were).
April 4, 2008 10:05 a.m. pdmracing

Funny, fiat brakes are usually ATE
April 4, 2008 10:49 a.m. Burke

Don't forget about the Brit's pride and joy "Lucas, Prince of Darkness"
April 4, 2008 10:54 a.m. Gary

Anybody know what condition the car was in before the crash, or who maintains his cars? Seinfeld isn’t a rookie with old cars so I wouldn’t think the crash was due to poor vehicle condition. And he’s not a moron so I doubt he’d drive around in a 40-year-old car without knowing the condition of the brakes. And like Leno and Lauren, he can afford competent mechanics. Maybe it wasn’t the brakes at all. "Mechanical failure" is a frequent excuse for inattention or inept driving or over-driving the conditions.

Not that there’s anything wrong with that …
April 4, 2008 11:12 a.m. Burke

I have done a little poking around before out of curiosity about Jerry's collection. Not much info out there. I am a 356 guy and in that circle you often hear about his Porsche collection, but not much else...
April 4, 2008 11:33 a.m. Coupefan

I didn't see anything about the police investigation, like a DUI test in the event of an accident.
April 4, 2008 12:23 p.m. Coupefan

New information:

Also Chris Obert posted the following on the Fiat America mailing list:

:Both Jay Leno & Jerry bought Fiats last week. Jerry's was a 1967 500 F. His :workshop ordered a repair manual, but I guess Jerry got too excited to wait for :them to check over the car.
April 4, 2008 4:43 p.m. Jerry From LA

Guys,

Let's cut the name calling and remember one thing; When brakes fail on a 40-year-old car, it is not a design issue. It is not a quality issue. It is a MAINTENANCE issue.

The reason Mr Seinfeld bought this FIAT is the same reason any of us buy Italian or British cars. They have many outstanding qualities that lead people to keep and preserve them. If these cars sucked, they would never get to BE 40 years old. Parts can't live forever, especially perishable items like rubber seals and hoses. If you bought a 40 year old airplane, would you jump right in and fly it? Would you put your kids in it and take off without giving it a thorough inspection and fixing whatever is broke or even doubtful? HELL NO.

The fault in this case lies with Mr. Seinfeld. I don't care how good the car looks or when it was last driven; Were it mine, that car gets a stem-to-stern checkout so I don't put my family or other motorists in harm's way. The whole affair should be a lesson to the general populace who don't drive 40-year-old collector cars. Are you SURE you know your car's true condition? Would you bet your life on it?
April 5, 2008 8:30 a.m. NOHOME

I see a trend here where Brittish car guys have a sense of humour about the cars and the Italians are defensive. Must have something to do with the short legs and long arms!
April 5, 2008 9:49 a.m. Coupefan

Rocky Balboa would agree with you. The longer arms are an evolutionary adaptation suited for smacking individuals who make moronic posts.
April 6, 2008 11:37 a.m. JuanLopez

I almost killed myself when the breaks on a friends Fiat Spider let go. Not a fun memory.
April 7, 2008 5:54 a.m. Dwight Varnes

Perhaps your memory isn't so good. You've forgotten the proper spelling of "brakes" as well.
April 7, 2008 10:39 p.m. jm1na

"I almost killed myself when the breaks on a friends Fiat Spider let go. Not a fun memory."

Neither is the memory of the left front ball joint seperating on a friend's Fiat spider while making a left turn at an intersection...
April 8, 2008 7:12 a.m. Brett Melancon

Dang, I should sell all of my Italian cars and buy some English stuff since NOTHING bad ever happens to them due to lack of maintenance or negligence. Maybe the Brits are onto something here.
April 8, 2008 7:37 a.m. Tim Baxter Online Editor

This isn't a Brit vs Italian thing, and it's silly for anyone to try to make it one. Both made some great, great cars over the years, and both have suffered mightily in the US from neglect and ham-fisted "mechanics".

Like I said on page 1:
Seinfeld's Fiat is more than 40 years old. Any car that old needs the brakes inspected closely and repaired as needed, no matter how good they were when they were new, or whether it was made in Italy, England, or Uranus.
April 8, 2008 9:25 a.m. Snakedriver

I have had all Britsh cars except for a Fiat 124, but I do hang out with some German car guys. I do think that there is a certain mentality associated with each car or country of orgin. Its all good though.
April 8, 2008 11:08 a.m. Brett Melancon

I agree. I said earlier that I love the British cars. My beef is when someone says that the car broke BECAUSE it was a Fiat. We all know that this is not true, neglect is the biggest culprit here.